Bhakta Dave: As I was just pulling up to a clients home my mobile rang, it was my dear friend HH Mahavishnu Swami he was waiting for the announcement of the flight to take him to the Congo were he will be staying for the next month. Why was he calling me? it was to see if I had received the e-mail of a proposal that we wish to submit to the GBC (a copy of this proposal is included later).
Firstly may I point out that although the name of Pragosh Dasa appears it has not been e-mailed to him get for approval; it has however been approved by HH Mahavishnu Swami who thinks also that the approval of Pragosh should not be a problem but please bear this in mind when reading.
Secondly some background should be given as to how this came about, during the stay of HH Mahavishnu Swami we got onto the topic of initiation and the problems surrounding initiation. This moved swiftly onto the problems some have of finding a spiritual master or fully understanding the role of the spiritual master. I recalled an incident last year were several young devotees were offered initiation by an individual who at the time was not in the renounced order of life but was contemplating it, worse still he also had some scathing comments about ISKCON and it’s initiating gurus. Ok! So I talked to some trusted senior devotees who flagged it up with the UK management and it was immediately dealt with but the lack of this basic information to new devotees made them some what vulnerable. We also then went on to discuss how many now rely on the internet as a source of information which when we look at ISKCON proves problematic. I have found that a simple internet search provides lots of information on the sad past and misuse of power within ISKCON. And unless we know of the different spiritual masters names there again we see only negative points and attacks from various sources which leaves a bad impression; if only their was a place on the internet a one stop shop were we could find out the correct information and gain first class advice on initiation, spiritual masters and ISKCON. HH Mahavishnu talked about his idea of a book with a picture of the current initiating spiritual masters with some information that could be published, this idea was treated with some suspicion, could it be used by those with few disciples to gain more at the expense of other popular ones?; but for me the question was why not have a similar thing on the internet with this added information, it’s more cheaper and more practical and would serve many aspiring devotees not only now but in the future and as a resource if it is used properly would become one of the first sights shown via an internet search; giving a true picture and representation of ISKCON.
Thirdly we discussed the need to help the individual not only find a centre but also make contact with a senior devotee (disciple) of the spiritual master they were interested in, who can take some time to answer questions, direct and sort out the wheat from the chaff. After some time a formal meeting could be arranged and so the relationship can begin this is mentioned as being the inclusion of an e-mail contact. Not that we give freely our spiritual masters e-mails after all we must appreciate how bus they are.
It was felt that I should write a proposal including my thought as to why this makes sense; it has been subsequently been sent for changes and insertion of some points of ISKCON law of which I know nothing about and to format it in a way that is acceptable by the members of the GBC. I feel that by posting it here on my blog it would firstly not cause any offence and in the hope that those more experienced senior devotees may have some thoughts either negative or positive or to at least stimulate discussion in an area I feel is much neglected.
PROPOSAL NAME: ISKCON GURU WEBSITE
PROPOSED BY: Bhakta Dave (Whales) and HH Mahavishnu Swami
SPONSORED BY (GBC member): Praghosa Prabhu
CONTACTS (removed for this posting on blog)
DATE OF SUBMISSION: 15 November 2008
PRESENTATION OF PROPOSAL:
Whereas:
- The Internet is becoming the main source of information and communication globally.
- There are devotees in remote areas, areas not frequently visited by other devotees or spiritual masters, areas with no temples, as well as interested persons who may search on the Internet to find out about ISKCON gurus.
- If one presently does a search on the Internet and type in keywords such as “ISKCON Guru,” a host of negative articles from non-ISKCON websites appear, describing fall-downs, refuting and holding our spiritual masters in contempt.
- Some individual ISKCON guru websites exist, but everyone may not be familiar with the specific names in order to find these.
- Srila Prabhupada encouraged the use of modern communication methods in Krishna’s service.
- ISKCON needs to have bonafide websites on the Internet to project a positive and correct image, covering different aspects of the society.
- According to ISKCON Law * 6.4.3.1 and 7.1 aspirants for initiation should be left to choose spiritual masters and not be subjected to any pressures from local authorities or peers to choose a particular guru even if he is the local one.
- According to ISKCON Law * 6.4.3.1Gurus should not be overtly canvassing for disciples or their disciples be encouraged by them to be canvassing for them.
- ISKCON unity is being spoiled by guru’s parties within temples and zones.
PRESENTATION OF RESOLUTION:
Resolved, That . . .
- An official ISKCON Initiating Guru website on the Internet be designed and regularly updated.
- The GBC should appoint a GBC member to oversee this project.
- Sponsors and devotees with good IT skills be found to develop the project.
The following information be made available regarding all ISKCON’s initiating spiritual masters, following an unbiased standard format minimum content presentation for each guru ,”big or small”, even if individual gurus already have their own website:
Name Brief History Number of Disciples Main areas visited Link to their website (if any) An email / contact address Photos Audio/Video Clips Excerpts from their writings
With a search facility on the site to include:
View all information on each Guru Look at those who visit your area A list of centres and temples
The site should also contain scriptural information on the meaning and role of a spiritual master and initiation procedures.
It should also give information of any past GBC public statements about or recommendations for any particular gurus, so that an aspiring seeker can know the “worst” officially, not through rumours.
It can also have a resume of former fallen spiritual masters whose disciples may be in good standing in ISKCON.
EXPLANATION:
(1) What prompts you to submit this proposal?
As a preacher I am often asked how to find a spiritual master practically, and I live in a rural area far from any ISKCON centre. This question is often raised by people coming in the association of devotees: “I am trying to choose my ISKCON spiritual master but I do not know who to choose from. Please help me.” I tried searching on the Internet myself in order to recommend a particular site to interested persons, but I was overwhelmed and shocked by the amount of negative publication. I realize there was an ISKCON Sannyasa website, but nothing about Initiating Gurus.
(2) Why this proposal is important for the success of ISKCON?
The Internet is the first place many people turn to in order to find information on any subject, and a positive website presenting ISKCON gurus may attract and direct interested individuals to ISKCON. The website will serve as a preaching tool as well as assist many aspiring devotees to get connected to the bonafide Guru Parampara. It can also serve as a checklist against unbonafide gurus.
(3) What would be the implications of implementing this proposal?
There are many devotees expert in the IT field who may be eager to assist with the development and sponsoring of such a website. One/more GBC member, however, may have to be appointed to oversee the project. Spiritual masters will have to submit information required of them.
* APPENDIX
RELEVANT RULES FROM THE ISKCON LAWBOOK:
Chapter 6 ISKCON Spiritual Masters
6.4.3 Standards of Conduct for Gurus in ISKCON
6.4.3.1 General standards
6)must not canvass for disciples
7)Must allow all uninitiated devotees full freedom to exercise their right to accept initiation from the guru of their choice.
8)Must allow uninitiated devotees who have preliminarily taken shelter of him the full freedom th change their minds on their choice of initiating guru.
Chapter 7 Discipleship in ISKCON
7.1 Right of devotees to choose their own Guru
7.1.2 All members of ISKCON have the right to accept diksa or siksa from the guru of their choice provided that the guru is qualified and approved to initiate, the candidate is eligible to accept initiation, and that all the relevant procedures set forth in ISKCON Laws have been strictly observed.
7.1.3 Right to Take Association from any approved Guru. Any uninitiated devotee in ISKCON has the right to read the publications, hear the recorded talks and bhajans, take darsana of, correspond with, or associate in various feasible ways with any authorised ISKCON Guru.
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1. Dasam Says:
November 1st, 2008 at 3:59 am
It is an interesting idea. It looks like you are trying to make life of a disciple much simpler. It also will allow disciples to be more realistic and see their guru as ‘one of many’.
The obvious problems with this resolution are that again the position of a sisksa relationship that naturally leads to diksa is sidelined. It will appear to a new devotee, that he is not allowed to choose the devotee who preaches to him and is acting as a siksha guru to be his initiating guru. That is against the basic sastric requirements.
You are also introducing a category of ‘fallen’ gurus, and that is against the conclusions of the sastra, as the guru can not be fallen, and if some individuals were acting as gurus and are not Vaishnavas anymore, they should not be referred as gurus.
Yet another problem is the ‘online shop’ idea, as if by looking at the picture and by checking the area and number of disciples the individual should get his sraddha together. That is not how it works, the sraddha is a result of the personal association and hearing, not looking at the internet pages.
Even if there is an official page that describes what is proposal, there is no reason to suspect that in the way it will be designed there will be a preference from one guru to another, after all you will need to have a neutral way of listing gurus. If alphabetically, it will call for devotee gurus in the middle of the list to be in disadvantage. If in the order of the time that one has assumed the duties, it will disadvantage the devotees who are just recently taken up this service. And certainly the devotees who are not as ‘good looking’ will be seriously disadvantaged. There also could be a difficulty in listing devotees who are like Jayapataka Maharaja recently, are not in the shape to travel what to speak of initiating new disciples.
The last but not the list problem is the problem of name and fame. True guru may not want to present himself as a guru or to be ‘listed’ as one. One may after all consider it to be an upadi. As Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati said: “I am not. Never was. Newer will be a spiritual master.” So if a devotee will rightly and humbly request the right to be removed form the list, while still performing the duties of a guru towards others. the idea will become highly dysfunctional.
2. Carana Renu dasi Says:
November 1st, 2008 at 4:26 am
I think it´s a great idea. It will be very useful for anyone thinking about initiation. It will allow them to make a more informed decision.
As well as containing info about the role of the guru, I think it is important that the website contains a lot of info about the role of the disciple. Sometimes people want to get initiated but don´t know what it really involves on their part.
Thank you for taking the time to write this important proposal. I hope it will be approved.
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